I recently played backgammon in person with two different Englishmen. Each of them independently of the other mentioned some rules I've never played by and which don't show up in "offical" backgammon books I've seen, but which they said were widespread here in the UK.
Color me curious. :-)
So I went looking around, and one of the rules they mentioned I've found fairly well-documented and described: It says that you can't put more than five checkers on a point. Fair enough, and easy to understand.
But there were other differences as well that I didn't quite clock, related to bearing off (having to bear off if you could, rather than moving within home strategically -- which could be hugely significant in "back game" situations) and (I think?) not having to use both die if you don't want to.
The closest thing I've found to a discussion of these is in this forum thread on another site. And that, not to put too fine a point on it, is a bunch of Americans trying to remember rules they've seen Brits playing by. So not that reliable a source of information.
So: Calling all British players! What are these rules? Is there any consensus? Does it vary by country, by region, by generation?
EDIT: I'm not suggesting that we would change our main rules for Backgammon. We have several Backgammon variations on the site -- Longgammon, Hypergammon, Nackgammon, cube and non-cube matches, etc. -- I'm just wondering about these rules with an eye toward possibly offering an additional variant.
When I learned backgammon as a boy I played the 5 max on a point. I play a fair number of on line backgammon games and none of them appear to use this rule. To me having the rule makes it more of a challenge and I would welcome it!!! Never heard of the other rules you mention. Cheers!!
I'm American and I know your looking for British input but just thought I would add. Since we play with people from different countries shouldn't we be using what I would consider international rules? Also it seems to me it would add more challenge to the game.
shouldn't we be using what I would consider international rules?
We do, the rules we have in place are the most widely-used rules internationally (by a huge margin, in fact; there's a lot of consensus in Backgammon). We're certainly not looking to change that!
What I'm interested in learning here is whether there's enough variation to justify considering having a "British Backgammon" variant, just like we have Hypergammon, Longgammon, and Nackgammon... -- T.J. Crowder First Primate Pocket-Monkey.com
I think you'd do better to have entirely different variants like Tapa, Narde and Acey/Deucey than a tweak of standard backgammon.
As far as it being British backgammon or even English backgammon, these rules are almost certainly not in use in any of the serious clubs, for example Manchester, Liverpool, Bristol. Backgammon in London (an organisation that covers several clubs and tournaments) wouldn't dream of using anything but international rules.
Tapa, Narde, and Acey/Deucey are all also on my list.
This site isn't about official rules used in clubs, or at least, not exclusively. It's about giving people a place to play social games they're used to. If casual English players are used to these sorts of rules, great, let's give them a variant where they can play those rules if they like. -- T.J. Crowder First Primate Pocket-Monkey.com
I've never heard of the must-bear-off-exactly rule in Backgammon. In fact I've only seen it in Crazy Narde where it has the effect of making luck be a huge part of the game. A player can be 100+ pips behind yet win simply because the opponent cannot get the right dice to bearoff. It's nice to get a repreieve win like that but to play your heart out and get well ahead only to lose, because the dice won't cooperate ay the end when the fat lady is warming up, can be very dissatisfying.
The not-having-to-use-both-dice rule isn't as loose as it sounds. Rather than being able to arbitrarily use only a single diec, what it means is that if using one dice prevents you from using the other then you can do that move, even if moving the other dice first would allow you to use both dice. This is in contrast to the official dice rule which is that you must maximise the dice usage, ie. use both dice if you can and use the higher of the two if you can't.
Re: British Rules?
Message #16555 Replies: 1
posted by ladytorch (Rusty Douglas) on 05/20 at 03:31
"We doan need no steenkeeng ruuuuulesss...."(exaggerated Mexican accent)
Ok so I'm not in the UK and I don't know those rules but I figured a laugh would be welcomed by a fellow primate anyhow. GL with that BTW - will be interested in learning to play a different way.
I think that's a quote from the film, Blazing Saddles BTW. (the memory goes at my age.)
That quote is indeed from Blazing Saddles, but it was Brooks paying homage to the 1948 Bogart film The Treasure of the Sierra Madre. Bogart's character is confronting bandits who claim they're Federales (Mexican Federal Police). He says something like "If you're the police, where are your badges?" The bandit replies, "Badges? We ain't got no badges. We don't need no badges. I don't have to show you any stinkin' badges!" Brooks shortened it for comic effect: "Badges? We don't need no stinkin' badges!" And a comic meme was born.
And I really need to get out more. ;-)
-- T.J.
Re: British Rules?
Message #16575 Replies: 1
posted by ladytorch (Rusty Douglas) on 05/20 at 17:48
WOW thanks for the back story. I love Blazing Saddles - have to watch it at least once a year.
I have played backgammon for 35 years and more than 5 on a point is allowable,but although you make move stratigically when bearing off you MUST use both dice (at all times in the game if possible)To my knowledge the rules do not change having played in Greece and Cyprus and the Middle East (the birth place of the game,i found no changes
Again, I'm talking about a British variation, not a change to the main rules. The main rules of backgammon, those used in the overwhelming majority of clubs worldwide and in all international competitions are the main ones we use here. I'm just looking to see if there's a British variation that's played (casually) widely enough in the UK that it might be fun to offer as an option. -- T.J. Crowder First Primate Pocket-Monkey.com
In nearly 50 years of playing in UK, I've never heard of these rules. The beauty of BG when played in real time is the fast nature of the game. Bish, bash, bosh, unassailable winning position, offer a double and get on with the next round! This variation would inevitably slow the online version even more. I wouldn't play it. (And since when has Dundee been a LONG way from the west coast? Nowhere is very far from anywhere in my beloved native land.)
Completely by coincidence, I've just found out that GNU Backgammon calls the max-five-on-a-point rule the "Eqyptian" rule (and no longer supports it). Huh.
hi TJ my friend runs B.I.B.A (british isles backgammon association) and his reply to your discussion is :
Five on a point maximum: The is a variation of backgammon that is uncommon unless it is played in the services (mostly Navy) or in prison! I know four players who are/were in prison and they all moaned about this rule - but, for some reason it has become normal inside. The Navy connection is perhaps linked to Acey Duecy but I am not sure. Suffice to say, no serious backgammon player uses this rule.
Bearing Off: I have never in over thirty years of playing come across this rule. The closest I can get is when I play in Turkey. There, if you roll a 4-1 for instance, you cannot play the 1 first in order to prevent leaving a blot with the 4. The 4 must be played even if it leaves a blot!
Thanks Caroline. It's really weird, because both of them independently mentioned the bearing off rule as well (though I don't think either of them was really sure what the rule was), and I'm quite certain neither of them has been in prison or the Navy. :-) If it had just been one, I'd've figured it was a "family rule," but as it was both and they're unrelated... Hmmm, I'll have to interrogate them.
Thanks! That's very interesting, since so many Brits seem to have heard of at least the five checker rule. If you don't mind my asking, what region were you in when you learned to play? -- T.J. Crowder First Primate Pocket-Monkey.com
TJ - me from Somerset??? Not likely!!! Born in Dundee, hence the nic. Learned and played backgammon on the west coast of Scotland - far removed from Dundee, lol!!!
In all the years that I have been playing backgammon, I do know that on some internet sites and in some options, that once you are down to 6 or less pips bearing off, they only allow you one die to roll. I hope you bring Acey Duecey as a variant soon, its great fun to play~!!!!
Rules of no more than 5 ckeckers on one column and the bearing off (by which I mean if you roll a 5 and a 1 you can only move if you have a pip/checker of excactly 5 and 1 to go home (not 3 or 2... for this you will need to roll a 3 or 2)are played in Germany. hope it helps.
I should have known they'd have it there: Old English Backgammon. They don't mention anything about bearing off rules, but they mention the five checkers on a point rule and the thing about being able to make a move with one die that prevents your using the other.
Thanks!
-- T.J. :-)
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